I have this love/hate relationship with Google.
Probably most people reading this know that Google assigns every page on the Internet a Page Rank between 0-10. You can check your Page Rank here. Google uses this Page Rank, together with other factors, to determine how easy it is for people to find your Internet site in their search engine. Just for the record, at the time of writing this post, the front page of this blog has a Page Rank of 5.
A Page Rank of 0 is a special case and means Google just doesn’t know about your site yet. A rank of 1 or 2 means something is wrong with your blog or Internet site, either Google just doesn’t understand the information there or it believes you are only providing commercial or other information that’s not useful. A rank of 3 or 4 is normal, and very respectable. A rank of 5 or 6 means you are a very popular site. A rank of 7 or 8 means you are in the top 1% or so of Internet sites, and these are mostly associated with online newspapers or magazines. Only a very small handful of sites have a Page Rank of 9, and only Google itself has a 10.
It’s important to point out that if you have a blog, post from time to time and don’t have too many ads or links to low ranked sites, you almost certainly have a Page Rank of at least 3 or 4 and don’t have anything to worry about.
A Page Rank of 3 or 4 would honestly suit me just fine. I sometimes find it annoying having a high Page Rank, because it often leads to people finding this blog for frivilous reasons. A good example of this would be my Fava Bean (Broad Bean) post from some years ago, which continues to receive ongoing comments. My most valued readers are regular ones, and I think most people find this blog via other blogs anyway, so I don’t really put a high value on scoring well in Google.
At the same time, I can’t afford to totally ignore Google. I wouldn’t want to neglect my Google rankings to the point where I totally fell out of search results, but also for all of us that have blogs or other Internet pages, our Google Page Ranks have an impact on one another. We share Google Page Rank by linking to each other, and mostly for that reason it makes sense for me to try to maintain as high a Google Page Rank as possible.
When someone links to me, I gain a little bit of Page Rank. When I link to someone else, the same thing happens, they gain Page Rank.
However there’s not an infinite amount of Page Rank floating around the Internet, and when someone places a link on their Internet site or blog, they also lose a little bit of Page Rank themselves. The amount of Page Rank they lose is proportional to the difference in Page Rank between the two sites. For example, if I have a Page Rank of 5 and I link to someone else who has a Page Rank of 1, this is a very expensive link for me to place. If the site I link to has a page rank of 5 or 6, I don’t really lose much, and if they in turn link back to me, in fact there is a net gain.
It’s important for this blog to be the least burden possible on other blogs who wish to link here. Likewise, it’s important when I link to someone else this site receive maximum benefit from that link, as it would if I have a higher Page Rank myself to begin with.
Most of you have also noticed I have a personal link to a page where I rent out an apartment locally, and while I’m not expecting anyone here particularlly to click through and rent the apartment from this blog, the increase in Page Rank my apartment page receives as a result of being linked to from this blog is very substantial and important in helping me keep it rented. It’s important this page continues to receive maximum benefit from this blog.
The Bottom Line
Probably most people reading this are wondering by now what I’m rambling about, but this is a round about way of explaining that I am about to go through all the external links on the front page of this blog and rationalize them in terms of how much Page Rank they are costing me to have. In particular, I intend to remove all links to Internet sites with a Google Page Rank of 1 or 2, and I will consider sites with a Page Rank of 3 on a case by case basis. Like I mentioned above, a Page Rank of 0 is a special case, and I will keep these links.
I’ve already taken some other steps over the last few months to improve my Page Rank, and this is the next logical thing to do.
This is a little painful for me, and a number of these sites have information I would like to maintain a link to. However, a Page Rank of 1 or 2 means there’s something wrong with your site, and it should be fixed so you aren’t a burden to those who link to you. If you want my help in fixing it, send me an email and I’ll see what I can do. Once you improve your Page Rank, I can consider putting the link back to you.
A good quick way of improving your Page Rank is to get it included in the DMOZ, or just get other people to link to you.
As is always the case, I try to keep my Blogroll current. If you have a blog, and haven’t written anything in the last month or two and I don’t expect to see much anytime soon, I’ll probably remove your link. If I notice you’re posting again, I usually put the link back.
Patrick
When a blog-site-anything is new starts with PR0. In the next PR update the same blog-site-anything probably will have bigger PR (PR1 or PR2)
PR1 or PR2 is not bad if the blog-site-anything is online only some months.
Usually Google updates the PR every 3 or 6 months, so the first year is important for a blog-site-anything to build the PR.
CityGarden has PR3 now but last month it was in PR2. It was not bad and it was not problem, it was just a new blog for Google
🙂
So if you want to clean your blogroll it’s better to see if the people you have in your blogroll updates their blogs or not.
If you ask me I hate blogrolls. I stop give them attencion (in my greek blogs) last year. I prefere trackbacks for PR 🙂
Hi CityGarden,
You’re right of course. In my case I didn’t have any links to PR 1 or 2 blogs that were new, but I would have given them a chance before removing them from the blogroll. After several months, anyone who tries should be able to get at least a 3. If not, there’s something wrong with their blog in my opinion, especially if someone like me is linking to them with a PR5. By the way, I would be very happy to try to help anyone who’s having problems with this!
I hate blogrolls too! It seems like there’s too much politics in choosing who is in your blogroll or not. Mostly I try to keep it to other people who are growing heirloom plants, and only current blogs, but of course it’s never as simple as that.
I much prefer trackbacks than adding people to my blogroll, and try to do these whenever I think of it.
Really, when it comes down to it, I hate having to pay attention to PR. I really don’t like the way Google has set it all up.
What’s trackback (why didn’t I pay attention to the details!!)
Hi OG,
If I understand it myself, that’s just when you link to a post on a different blog. Depending on the blogging software you use, different things can happen. For example between WordPress blogs, if trackbacks are enabled, a comment will automatically be left on the post being linked to mentioning another blog is linking there. Doesn’t Blogger have a spot for a list of incoming links at the end of the comments?
Anyway, with a blogroll you are listing your favorite blogs, but with trackbacks it’s more like you are identifying your favorite posts. A link is a link, and while link in a blogroll will probably be more important for PR, any incoming link helps.
I had no idea. Wow. For some reason the page rank site you linked to didn’t work for me, but this one did: http://www.prchecker.info/check_page_rank.php
Showed I have a 4. Considering my blog has only been around for 4 months, I guess that isn’t bad? I’m sure I probably link to other blogs who have lower page ranks, due to the challenges I host and local resources I post… hmmm… In those cases, for me the benefits outweigh the Google ranking issues.
Hi Melinda!
Thanks for stopping by. Indeed I remember looking at some of the statistics of your site a month or so ago, and being very impressed on how popular it had become in such a short time. I think you really are striking a cord with a lot of people.
And, yes, the PR tool you link to works better than my link!
As far as linking to low ranking sites, it’s always a bit of a judgement call, but it’s not my intention to refuse links to actively maintained sites with ideas I want to promote.
In my experience, a PR1 or PR2 means there is something wrong with the site. I have never seen a seriously maintained site with a PR of 1 or 2 that couldn’t somehow be fixed with a few small changes.
Of course I don’t want to stick my nose in anyone’s site who doesn’t want me there, but I’m happy to help sort out any problems that might be behind such a low PR. Of course implied in this offer is the possibility I might be proved wrong and fixing the site may not work, in which case I may reconsider my position.
At the same time, it’s been observed that influence associated with PR seems to be logarithmic, so an increase of 1 in your PR increases your influence on the Internet by a factor of 10.
Since I have been at a PR5 for some time, and recently I’ve gained links from some PR6 and PR7 sites, it seems likely my PR will increase and seems to be the case that existing links to low PR sites are the reason this hasn’t already happened.
If I move from a PR5 to a PR6, and have 10 times the influence, it’s likely for example that most people I link to will see their PR increase by 1 (at least most PR3 will go to PR4 and most PR4 will go to PR5). These people in turn will have more impact when they link to other people, and what they write will be more easily found in Google. When I link to a new site, they are much more likely to be found faster by Google then they are now.
In my opinion, I am very unlikely to go to a PR6 if I have any links at all to PR1 or PR2 sites. It seems a reasonable price to pay that I end up dropping a few links to people who have problems with their sites they don’t want to fix!
Yes, this is all a game we hate playing, and of course our values are more important than the game. At the same time, not playing the game can mean we get left out…
Interesting post Patrick – I had no idea all this stuff goes on in the back ground. I don’t understand what a trackback is either. I suspect it does not work on my site as you know its an oddity in Domino, a custom made job.
But a blogroll I can do and It did inspire me to go through my links – which has been an intersting expercise – I link to a lot of sites but not that many link to mine – not sure why maybe I just like theirs a lot more than they like mine. Anyway, I’ve hurt my foot and am laid up so a good opportunity to do some site maintenance. Put links on I forgot to add and remove some I don’t really read. Mine comes out as a 4 no idea why, and some I have that I really like come out as 0- is there a reason for a zero rating?
Hi Laura,
You might remember when I first came across your site, and I suggested including some gardening blogs in your blogroll. This is because Google looks at your outgoing links, and tries to put you in a category, for example ‘gardening blog’. At the time you had such an eclectic blogroll, Google probably wasn’t able to put you in any particular category. I’m pretty sure your PR at the time was a 2.
Now that you’ve fixed that problem with your blogroll and a number of other blogs link to you, you’re a PR4. That’s what happens when you give a little bit of thought to Google and just fix simple problems.
A zero rating just usually means you don’t have any incoming links, you are too new or Google just doesn’t see anything of importance. I was just noticing my top level page is a PR0, probably because there are no pictures, the information is static, only one external link and hardly any incoming links. You really need at least one outgoing link (that points outside your domain), a little formatting or a picture and occasional updates for Google to take any page seriously.
HI Patrick
when you came across mas du diable I didn’t actually know what a blogroll was so I didn’t have one – i had links to gardening and related resources (they are still there managed by the CMS). It is great to have found all these people blogging about growing food and saving seeds.
The zero rating sites I link to I would think are high profile so it may be the page I have linked to. I’ll investigate.
PS I tried linking to your informal Garden Blog Seed Savers Network page (I’ve linked to other pages of yours before) but just to find out if it shows up your end some how.
Great post, way more informative than Google’s own material! My page rank was at zero and then it jumped up to 3 suddenly. I will work to improve my blog roll. I have had great difficultly with the limitations of blogger, for instance, sitemaps. I haven’t found a way to add a sitemap to blogger to restrict the comments from being crawled. I fear “duplicate title” errors caused by the comments and archives may be hurting my page rank. Ugh! Sometimes, often, I hate Blogger.
I have no idea what any of this means. When I search for my blog by name, it comes right up…that is all I can ask. I subscribe to google analytics so my sitemap is always current.
ANYWAY…I just found you on the Recommended Page for my Google Reader…so Google likes you!!! I have just added my subscription.
I recently made a wonderful free download for a SEED SAVER PACKET that you and your readers might like. My readers loved it. Here is the URL:
http://contentinacottage.blogspot.com/2008/09/free-download-seed-saving-envelope-for.html
I blog a lot about gardening. I will add you to my blogroll if you will add me to yours! Let me know. Thanks. ♥Rosemary
wow, thanks for the tips. i must admit i was rather clueless about pagerank. I still have memories of the old days when people would blatantly include tons of search terms in white text on white background.
i looked through my blogroll and kicked out a bunch of stale blogs that were PR2, so maybe that’ll move me back up to PR5 whenever they reassess me.
Far be it for me to claim to understand Google but what I do know is that there are a great many factors involved in creating page-ranking – and site-ranking. The page rank you’re referring to is site-wide. My impression is the real goal is to have individual page rankings do well on the primary search database in Google so you create traffic – and not be stuck in the supplementary databases. Site wide scores are only a small part of the weighting for each individual post is the way I understand it.
It still comes down to creating useful content for readers – do that and the Google-gawds will love you. Don’t do that and your bounce rate will kill you no matter what kind of linking out policies you have.
I’ll all for updating your Blogrolls but you can link to whoever you want regardless of PR as long as you use Nofollow links.
Google doesn’t pass link juice through Nofollow links. Your blog is already using them for the comments (as most blogging software does).
And by the way, PR0 can also be a penalized site.
Curious thing I tidied up my blogroll yesturday and just chucked the list in the checker today so I could point out which ones have a zero rating and try and understand why and now there is only one with a zero rating. Yesturday mustard plaster, Scarecrow’s Garden, permaculture reflections were all zero and today they have a score above Zero??? The only one left at zero is http://www.veggies-only.blogspot.com
So either there has been a mass tidy up in response to your post Patrick 🙂 or this thing is a bit quirky –
I can just about upload, an then post pictures Patrick!! I am a complete technophobe, (but can make apple pie) but I did the check and mines a 3….better than a 2!! happy dayz. Any advice you have on anything Blog based would be rather welcome!! See ya, Cat x
Thanks everyone for the comments!
Laura:
I should have made this clear from the start, but I don’t use the site I linked to above myself to lookup PR. It’s possible it doesn’t work well. Sorry about that!
The only way I know how to get PR information directly from Google is to install their toolbar on your browser, which shows you the PR of every page you visit. I don’t particularly recommend everyone go out and install this on your computer just to see PR, only if you are really serious about investigating PRs.
Whatever you do, don’t take Matron out of your blogroll for having a low PR, his is really PR4!
Cat:
See the next post!
Nor worries patrick no intention of taking anyone off because they have a low PR. non that I read anyway seem to have less than 3 and the ones that rate 0 must be an error.
fascinating topic thanks for posting.
This is the best PR explanation and conversation I’ve seen so far and I’m glad to find my own conclusions were broadly right. Too bad I had to go through the pain of reading some most boring techie websites to get to the same place as you!
Yes PR is a bit of a double edged sword: we need it to find the (supposedly) good stuff and for others to have a chance to find us, but there can be quite a bit of pain in the process.
And when we do get the increase in traffic, that can bring attendant issues too e.g. if a 3-fold increase in traffic results in a 3-fold increase in comments, how long can the more ‘personal’ relationships be maintained before blogging becomes a chore?
The answer to that will partly depend on why we blog in the first place…
Patrick, I want to let you know I’m still totally fascinated by this. I have been getting a lot more hits lately and a lot more Google referrals as well, and just checked my page rank and it’s now 5. So it really does bring more traffic!
Have you found your new scheme to be working?
Hi Melinda,
Yes, it works the way I explain it here, as far as I know. Keep in mind too that like any computer program, Google often has bugs and is dealing with a lot of data, so sometimes it just works better than other times. Just because you do everything right or wrong, doesn’t necessarily mean Google will notice right away or will do what you expect. Sometimes it’s all a little bit random. I’ve noticed a big increase in traffic too, and it may just be Google is working a little better at the moment.
I’m now a PR6, and my conclusion was I simply could not go from a 5 to a 6 without taking nearly all static links off the front of my blog, and this is why I made that change. Instead now I make links in posts and have a separate links page. I think this is probably true with you too, if going to 6 is what you want to do.
Just because you do everything right doesn’t necessarily mean you will get a PR6. I have incoming links from several PR6s and PR7s, and probably without similar links you will stay at a 5 no matter what you do.
Great blog